Curse

Merkaba · Feb 27, 2005, 06:11 AM // 06:11

-The Third Eye- is scanning for new members.
Visit www.infinitized.com and register in the forums to join.

???The Third Eye??? is a guild that was recently formed by two gentlemen who share a common appraisal for the music and inspired art of the band Tool. Our inspiration to create a guild on this foundation stems not just from a liking of the band, but from the sheer power they exude in reinforcing the message that ???If we look beyond our individual egos into the non-dual facets of both the darkness and the light alike, we will see that they are dependant upon each other for existence and are in fact inseparable???.

What does this have to do with Guild Wars...? Everything.

Guild Wars is a game that takes teamwork and cooperation to a new level of importance. As an individual ego, your character will gain many skills and you as a player will best master the use of them. Some builds however, will be better suited for some things than your own, regardless of how well you???ve honed your skills. Naturally, you will group with a various array of other characters to best broaden your abilities, it is the psychology of grouping that ???The Third Eye??? will focus most heavily upon.

Our goal as a guild is to not just put together the best parties (though surely we will), but to best incorporate playing styles and communication between members so that we as a group will in effect act as a single, formidable entity whose name is well known wherever we tread.

Alone, we are but lights, darks and shades of grey??? Together we begin to see the possibilities of an increased spectrum??? Acting as ONE, we become the prismatic diamond that cannot be broken and can cut through all things.

HotSnack · Feb 27, 2005, 12:39 PM // 12:39

My... how very cult-like of you.

Nevertheless, you guys do sound interesting, and as one who has a played a ranger/mesmer, I can only imagine the fun factor of a team of them would be.

Viktor · Feb 27, 2005, 01:46 PM // 13:46

You thought about naming the guild Tool Army, like the fanclub?

Heh tool rocks though.... I hope they lead you to many victories

Devil's Dictionary · Feb 27, 2005, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viktor

Heh tool rocks though.... I hope they lead you to many victories

I stood looking at 10$CAD "Lateralus" for twenty minutes. I still wonder if I did the right decision not to buy it...

Cicciro · Feb 27, 2005, 09:24 PM // 21:24

Of course it was the right decision... I could send you all four main albums

Devil's Dictionary · Feb 27, 2005, 09:36 PM // 21:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cicciro

Of course it was the right decision... I could send you all four main albums

Why? You don't like them?

I actually have Aenima and Lateralus on MP3 anyway. I admit: I just like the multilayered CD cover, I like Tool but don't love it.

Merkaba · Feb 27, 2005, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Stealing music is wrong....

thegriffgeeks · Feb 28, 2005, 01:16 AM // 01:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merkaba

Stealing music is wrong....

I believe the words about "sending of music" was said tongue in cheek.....

No need to jump to conclusions on stealing and calling people thieves

Shrapnel_Magnet · Feb 28, 2005, 02:20 AM // 02:20

I shamelessly download music... shh, the FBI is watching... oh wait, I'm in Canada where downloading is legal... whew. :P

Merkaba · Feb 28, 2005, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by thegriffgeeks

I believe the words about "sending of music" was said tongue in cheek.....

No need to jump to conclusions on stealing and calling people thieves

Even in a place where the downloading of intellectual property may not be illegal, it still ultimately only hurts the artist..
I'm sure you already get this, but I'll say it anyway: the reason copying
artwork of any kind is considered unethical, is that some person(s) put hundreds of hours into it's creation, for the amusement
of others. As such, that work represents his/her livelihood. In a perfect
world, those that find enjoyment in another's art, would support that art by
buying something from that artist, for in no other way can that artist
continue to make art. For example, you buy Tool's music on CD. In this way
you support the band, They make money, which enables them to devote their
time to making more music, which you enjoy. If everyone copied their work
(for their own private use, of course), the band would soon have to quit,
and take up some other kind of work...no more music.

I simply made a statement, 4 words actually....

I'm aware that one could very well send the actual albums that one was not interested in any longer to someone who wanted them. Though common sense in the modern world would suggest otherwise... hence my statement.

No need to jump to conclusions by telling me I've called anyone a "thief", that simply never happened.

Reverend · Feb 28, 2005, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merkaba

Even in a place where the downloading of intellectual property may not be illegal, it still ultimately only hurts the artist..
I'm sure you already get this, but I'll say it anyway: the reason copying
artwork of any kind is considered unethical, is that some person(s) put hundreds of hours into it's creation, for the amusement
of others. As such, that work represents his/her livelihood. In a perfect
world, those that find enjoyment in another's art, would support that art by
buying something from that artist, for in no other way can that artist
continue to make art. For example, you buy Tool's music on CD. In this way
you support the band, They make money, which enables them to devote their
time to making more music, which you enjoy. If everyone copied their work
(for their own private use, of course), the band would soon have to quit,
and take up some other kind of work...no more music.

I simply made a statement, 4 words actually....

I'm aware that one could very well send the actual albums that one was not interested in any longer to someone who wanted them. Though common sense in the modern world would suggest otherwise... hence my statement.

No need to jump to conclusions by telling me I've called anyone a "thief", that simply never happened.

Actually most bands only see just over a dollar per album depending on the deal they sign. The band would make more off of concert ticket sales and the t-shirts you buy at their concerts. So if you really want to support a band, go to their concerts and buy swag.

Most of the money from the cd sales goes to the record company. Which pays for recording costs, promotions, advances, and banking etc...

Just thought I'd add that, because some artists would rather give up the free downloaded cd to gain a fan that comes to a concert and spends money. Not that I'm advocating downloading, just adding more info to the mix.

thegriffgeeks · Feb 28, 2005, 08:45 PM // 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merkaba

I simply made a statement, 4 words actually....

and here they are

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merkaba

Stealing music is wrong....

You didn't say thief that is correct, but it is clearly implied otherwise you would have prefaced your comment with "I believe" or something else to indicate that you were stating your belief(s). Otherwise, it does come across as accusatory.

As I stated previously

Quote:

Originally Posted by thegriffgeeks

I believe the words about "sending of music" was said tongue in cheek.....

and apparently DRM is a hot button for you.

William of Orange · Feb 28, 2005, 10:45 PM // 22:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend

Actually most bands only see just over a dollar per album depending on the deal they sign. The band would make more off of concert ticket sales and the t-shirts you buy at their concerts. So if you really want to support a band, go to their concerts and buy swag.

Most of the money from the cd sales goes to the record company. Which pays for recording costs, promotions, advances, and banking etc...

Just thought I'd add that, because some artists would rather give up the free downloaded cd to gain a fan that comes to a concert and spends money. Not that I'm advocating downloading, just adding more info to the mix.

I concur. The label behind the artist fattens their coffers each time we buy their CD's, I would argue the counterpoint that downloading music offline can spur support for an artist. From personal experience, I had heard good things about the artist Jack Johnson, so I downloaded some of his songs. After hearing his work, I now plan on buying his works from here on out because I like his stuff so much and because it's somewhat of a hassle to find an uncorrupt file through the p2p networks. I know many other people who have experienced the same thing...

But about the Guild you're creating Merkaba, it sounds like you'll be very focused and supportive of your members, I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors...

Merkaba · Mar 01, 2005, 01:48 AM // 01:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend

Most of the money from the cd sales goes to the record company. Which pays for recording costs, promotions, advances, and banking etc...

...which allows for the continued promotion of an artist, which allows a fan base to grow (much, much more than an underpromoted artist's base will grow via a few people downloading their music via p2p), which allows touring (yes.. most income comes from this) to be a plausible profit-making venture as opposed to having to play 8 gigs a night just to eat and pay rent. (See Rollins Band circa 1980s-90s)

Allow me to draw a fine line between testing and stealing (which many here I'm sure are aware of and agree with). "Testing" a few songs via p2p or whatever is one thing, if you like what you hear and buy the album.. rock on, if you don't like it and don't buy it.. all the same. However, if you like a band and therefore download all of their music for your continued enjoyment and do not pay a dime for it... that is "stealing", refer to my original 4 word quote of much criticism for my feelings on this

But hey, it's only wrong if you get caught right?

I guess it could be equally argued that it's okay to litter because there are street sweepers and people who are actually paid by the city to go around and pick up your trash who would otherwise be out of a job... so any point can be argued equally both ways and I respect that.

On a very specific note though, Tool has expressed their discontent with the "theft" of their music on many occassions, so if someone decides to enjoy their music without supporting the artist who made it, it is an empty gesture.

Though I wish people would just join the guild

this thread has turned into a rather constructive debate and I dig all of your input and opinions (and ahem.. being accused of being accusatory).

P.S.- Jack Johnson is amazing and still low-budget enough to really appreciate your contributions

Shrapnel_Magnet · Mar 01, 2005, 02:00 AM // 02:00

Personally, I just don't like CD's. That is, I don't like 1 band on a CD only. I LIKE Mixed CD's. Sure, the artists can say that "song 13 was MEANT to go after song 12 because of this that and the other thing". That's awesome... however, I also would like more than 12- 15 songs on a CD and I'd like some variation of music. For my tastes, I prefer mixed cd's with songs that I choose.

If anything, I'd like to see record stores offer to mix a CD for you. You pick the songs, they master it for you... charge you like 12$ and there you are. They often sell songs for 1$ on those Online Sites, so why not even 12$ for 15 songs + a CD. I would never use it and I dunno if anyone would, but I still like the idea.

I prefer to buy t-shirts at concerts and such anyway... I get more use out of a T-Shirt than a CD that I'll never listen to (because I'll have made my own).

Merkaba · Mar 01, 2005, 04:01 AM // 04:01

I make mix cd's all the ime, I have a car full of em...

Once you buy the cd (or individual songs like you said), there is nothing stopping you from mixing them however and with whatever you see fit.

William of Orange · Mar 02, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

I like how the thread has gradually shifted from publicizing the new guild to becoming a debate on downloading music...

What kind of design will you have for your guild cape? I'll try and look for it come next Beta Event...

Of course, I probably should check out the website first before I ask a question like that too

Deliverance · Mar 02, 2005, 12:11 AM // 00:11

Never heard of Tool.
God Im old

Merkaba · Mar 02, 2005, 12:16 AM // 00:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by William of Orange

I like how the thread has gradually shifted from publicizing the new guild to becoming a debate on downloading music...

What kind of design will you have for your guild cape? I'll try and look for it come next Beta Event...

Of course, I probably should check out the website first before I ask a question like that too

Our guild emblem is the cool looking eye... the eye is centered within white which is outline in black... similar to the "smokebox" image on the Aenima cd cover. but yeah... check out the site

Devil's Dictionary · Mar 02, 2005, 05:53 AM // 05:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deliverance

Never heard of Tool.
God Im old

Tool? It's those things hanging on the walls on your garage. Screwdrivers, hammers and the such, you know? Same thing as the band, as far as sound goes

.

Feb 27, 2005, 06:11 AM // 06:11	#1
Merkaba Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Feb 2005	The Third Eye [Tool] -The Third Eye- is scanning for new members. Visit www.infinitized.com and register in the forums to join. ???The Third Eye??? is a guild that was recently formed by two gentlemen who share a common appraisal for the music and inspired art of the band Tool. Our inspiration to create a guild on this foundation stems not just from a liking of the band, but from the sheer power they exude in reinforcing the message that ???If we look beyond our individual egos into the non-dual facets of both the darkness and the light alike, we will see that they are dependant upon each other for existence and are in fact inseparable???. What does this have to do with Guild Wars...? Everything. Guild Wars is a game that takes teamwork and cooperation to a new level of importance. As an individual ego, your character will gain many skills and you as a player will best master the use of them. Some builds however, will be better suited for some things than your own, regardless of how well you???ve honed your skills. Naturally, you will group with a various array of other characters to best broaden your abilities, it is the psychology of grouping that ???The Third Eye??? will focus most heavily upon. Our goal as a guild is to not just put together the best parties (though surely we will), but to best incorporate playing styles and communication between members so that we as a group will in effect act as a single, formidable entity whose name is well known wherever we tread. Alone, we are but lights, darks and shades of grey??? Together we begin to see the possibilities of an increased spectrum??? Acting as ONE, we become the prismatic diamond that cannot be broken and can cut through all things.

Feb 27, 2005, 11:38 PM // 23:38	#7
Merkaba Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Feb 2005	Stealing music is wrong Stealing music is wrong....

Feb 28, 2005, 02:20 AM // 02:20	#9
Shrapnel_Magnet Pirate? Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: British Columbia, Canada Guild: Idiot Savants Profession: R/	I shamelessly download music... shh, the FBI is watching... oh wait, I'm in Canada where downloading is legal... whew. :P __________________ Show Some Beta Love!

Mar 01, 2005, 02:00 AM // 02:00	#15
Shrapnel_Magnet Pirate? Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: British Columbia, Canada Guild: Idiot Savants Profession: R/	Personally, I just don't like CD's. That is, I don't like 1 band on a CD only. I LIKE Mixed CD's. Sure, the artists can say that "song 13 was MEANT to go after song 12 because of this that and the other thing". That's awesome... however, I also would like more than 12- 15 songs on a CD and I'd like some variation of music. For my tastes, I prefer mixed cd's with songs that I choose. If anything, I'd like to see record stores offer to mix a CD for you. You pick the songs, they master it for you... charge you like 12$ and there you are. They often sell songs for 1$ on those Online Sites, so why not even 12$ for 15 songs + a CD. I would never use it and I dunno if anyone would, but I still like the idea. I prefer to buy t-shirts at concerts and such anyway... I get more use out of a T-Shirt than a CD that I'll never listen to (because I'll have made my own). __________________ Show Some Beta Love!

Mar 01, 2005, 04:01 AM // 04:01	#16
Merkaba Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Feb 2005	Mix tapes I make mix cd's all the ime, I have a car full of em... Once you buy the cd (or individual songs like you said), there is nothing stopping you from mixing them however and with whatever you see fit.

Feb 27, 2005, 12:39 PM // 12:39	#2
HotSnack Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: Feb 2005	My... how very cult-like of you. Nevertheless, you guys do sound interesting, and as one who has a played a ranger/mesmer, I can only imagine the fun factor of a team of them would be.

Feb 27, 2005, 01:46 PM // 13:46	#3
Viktor Elite Guru Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Sweden	You thought about naming the guild Tool Army, like the fanclub? Heh tool rocks though.... I hope they lead you to many victories

Feb 27, 2005, 09:24 PM // 21:24	#5
Cicciro Banned Join Date: Feb 2005	Of course it was the right decision... I could send you all four main albums

Mar 02, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02	#17
William of Orange Krytan Explorer Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: La Crosse, Wisconsin Guild: Thousand Tigers Apund Ur Head, The Consulate	I like how the thread has gradually shifted from publicizing the new guild to becoming a debate on downloading music... What kind of design will you have for your guild cape? I'll try and look for it come next Beta Event... Of course, I probably should check out the website first before I ask a question like that too Last edited by William of Orange; Mar 02, 2005 at 12:03 AM // 00:03.. Reason: Just thought of something...

Mar 02, 2005, 12:11 AM // 00:11	#18
Deliverance Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Northern Ireland Guild: The Biggeyverse Profession: N/	Never heard of Tool. God Im old